Considering this is a continuing problem, getting a backup opinion from a hydraulic specialist is not a bad idea. This means the reduction in heat-load from replacing the fixed-displacement pump with a variable-displacement unit resulted in a significant reduction in hydraulic oil temperature—which is normally a good thing! 8N - Hydraulic Lift - Troubleshooting, by Zane Sherman Troubleshooting the 8N Hydraulic Lift Before doing anything to the lift it should first be inspected for any internal leakage. On the opposite side of the diamond, Installed Cooling Capacity, as a percentage of continuous input power, should reflect the designed or native efficiency of the hydraulic system. Troubleshooting the fault Safely remove the hydraulic top cover Remove, assess and repair the pump and vavles As temperature increases, fluid viscosity decreases and vice versa. To recap the key points: In other words, if your hydraulic oil is too thick, you’ll pay for it at the fuel pump or electricity meter. Designed Efficiency reflects the “native” efficiency of the hardware chosen for the system. But with fuel consumption being more important than any modest saving in cooling capacity, the idea of paying more for a pump that resulted in the oil being kept at a lower operating temperature—but increased fuel consumption—was irreconcilable to the machine’s engineers. Low system-pump oil flow may be a… light started to flicker, so i changed the filter and hyd oil. While these tips are specifically for the Ford 8N, many other models of antique tractors will show similar symptoms when their hydraulics need attention. Course objectives include: Perform reservoir, heat exchanger, and pump maintenance Understand maintenance Product Blitz: Stay on Top of Innovations, Manufacturing’s Rebound is Complete: PMI Index Hits 60.7%, Advancing Fluid Dynamics Systems with AM featuring CERN, Pneumatic Valves Control Cataract Surgical Tool. Hydraulics is a system farmers need to learn to use. Male tip failures could include internal poppet/ball stop being damaged or has moved out of position. (ªRLR¢$Hå÷]ۉH­T!Á Ï®gvªÉDë8è5ጲ> ®h*!Ii&Aïɤè3¨zÇ`ÐW2™•6=A:ú"ô‰,]F³¡ 3*S¿‡‚Šàš¶‚p©ç¶eê[&™ÓÂO"8䉢‰ä±m†¯Îw,ÊKDzxEý9¢-0Š´ Using Troubleshooting Chart If you are experiencing a problem that is not listed in this chart, see your John Deere distributor for service. So getting a hydraulic machine into its power efficiency “sweet spot” requires informed design. thanks In fact, the ideal hydraulic fluid would have a viscosity index (the change in a fluid’s viscosity relative to temperature) represented by a horizontal line intercepting the Y axis at 25 centiStokes. More general information is "The new pump... appears to be creating heat." When this modification was tested, the engineers were shocked to find that fuel consumption had actually increased by 12 to 15%! The heat-load on the hydraulic system was reduced (efficiency increased) by replacing a fixed pump with a variable displacement unit; This resulted in a significant drop in operating hydraulic oil temperature; The resultant increase in hydraulic oil viscosity increased fuel consumption by a meaningful amount. Its a gas model. Why Your Hydraulic Machine Probably Needs an Oil Cooler—and a Big One! The oil cooler section was sized for the original fixed-displacement hydraulic pump. The hydraulic piston does the work; slow and intermittent piston action is the most obvious indicator of hydraulic circuit problems. Good troubleshooting section – think I’ve diagnosed my problem and can’t wait to get started on the strip-down of my TO35. The hydraulic oil’s viscosity, viscosity index, or the optimum viscosity number for the hydraulic components in the system apparently were not considered during the test. In order for the 'obvious' to be obvious, the fundamental laws of hydraulics must be kept in mind: Theory is great, but it always makes more sense when put into practice. "The new pump is delivering a maximum pressure of 1,000 PSI..." You can also test your injectors by removing them from the engine and hooking them back up to the steel fuel lines. It’s just that the input power—therefore, fuel or electricity consumption of the prime mover required to get it—keeps going up! /°X20¶sEõaÄ) One of our members wrote to me regarding the following problem: Engine cooling was improved by a thermostatically controlled hydraulic fan drive based on engine coolant temperature. This may, in part, be explained by the combination heat exchanger installed on the machine. This is the viscosity range where the hydraulic system will operate most efficiently: the highest ratio of output power to input power. available for FREE download here. And it’s unlikely such a fluid will be developed in my lifetime. The possibility of variation in ambient air temperature, particularly if the machine is moved between locations with different climatic conditions, is fairly obvious. 2003-05-27 55735 I have a Yanmar 1600 and the hydraulics quit working. And although design efficiency doesn’t vary, actual operating efficiency typically deteriorates over time from wear and tear. When a fluid (liquid) moves from an area of high pressure to an area of low pressure (pressure drop) without performing useful work, heat is generated. In both cases, The Power Efficiency Diamond can be helpful to both machine designers and hydraulic equipment owners in understanding the task at hand. For more information on reducing the operating cost and increasing the uptime of your hydraulic equipment, visit his website at  www.HydraulicSupermarket.com. For instance, Job will tell you how, when he was a boy, it saved his back by lifting implements on the farm. Tractor sat for 5 years. The tank, valves and cylinders were cleaned and a replacement pump installed. So let's apply these fundamentals to the above situation in a way that ensures the obvious things are not overlooked. Yesterday's Tractor Co.: Troubleshooting the Ford 8N Hydraulic Lift Writer Bio Wesley Tucker is a lifelong southerner whose politics are objective, whose sports are many and whose avocations range from aviation to anthropology to history and all forms of media. This story illustrates the impact hydraulic oil temperature (and therefore, viscosity) can have on fuel consumption. Hydraulics 101 for beginners. But she does (or at least should) determine the other three variables; design efficiency, installed cooling capacity, and oil viscosity. For now, we have multi-grade hydraulic oil. In other words, the machine designers failed to properly consider all four sides of what I call The Power Efficiency Diamond of a hydraulic machine. Also, check the clamps and mounts when the system is under pressure. In case the system pump is noisy, check the oil level and refill as required. Q and A: Answers to the Most Frequently Asked Questions about Hydraulics Q: What is the difference between a one-stage pump and a If the pump is producing flow, then an absence of pressure indicates an absence of resistance to flow. Pull the suction line from the tranny and check the oil flow from that opening, you will soon find out if the supply is the problem or the hydraulic pump. The ground drive on the machine already used a variable-displacement piston pump (hydrostatic transmission), so upgrading the attachment’s hydraulic circuit to a more-efficient configuration seemed logical progression by the machine’s design engineers. Because heat is generated when there is a pressure drop without useful work, using an infrared thermometer to check the temperature of individual components will quickly lead us to the hottest part of the system - and the probable location of the internal leakage. It is fantastic. I think this is the righ forum for this size tractor. The pump started making a whinning noise and now the lift want work. To illustrate the above point, consider this example: In the quest for improved fuel consumption, the manufacturer of an engine-powered, mobile hydraulic machine replaced its fixed-displacement pump powering the machine’s attachment with a variable-displacement unit. In any troubleshooting situation, no matter how simple or complex the hydraulic system, always start with the basics. pressureless circulation not provided (or does not switch on) during long working breaks (with pump still running) 3. insufficient hydraulic fluid in the installation 4. coolant valve fails to switch 5. thermostat set too high 6. coolant not switched on or no coolant available, an defective 7. coolant temperature too high 8. surrounding temperature too high 9. deposits in radiator 10. insufficient heat dissipation due to noise … In order for the 'obvious' to be obvious, the fundamental laws of hydraulics must be kept in mind. Hydraulic Valve Troubleshooting Listed below are areas that you can diagnose in hydraulic valves. If you don’t consider hydraulic fluid to be a critical component of any hydraulic system, you may suffer the same fate as these engineers. It was concluded that the modification tested could result in a small cost saving with respect to a reduction in size of the oil cooler. Can any tell me what might be the problem with my 2955 hydraulics? Assuming this trial was conducted at the same ambient temperature for both pump options, a 30° C (54° F) drop in hydraulic oil temperature is quite remarkable. Note that in all three cases, output power remains the same: 90 kW. This means more heat is dissipated from the hydraulic oil and, therefore, hydraulic oil viscosity increases further. Using Troubleshooting Chart If you are experiencing a problem that is not listed in this chart, see your John Deere dealer for service. When the lift won't come down it is a sure sign that you have dirty oil in the hydraulic reservoir or that the return spring which is under the intake valve is weak and needs to be replaced or stretched out again to increase it's tension. Upon analysis, the hike in fuel consumption was attributed to an increase in oil viscosity brought about by a 30°C drop in operating oil temperature. Re: Best place for troubleshooting hydraulics? Here are some suggestions to get you started fixing your tractor. If you're skilled in reading and interpreting hydraulic symbols, the system's schematic diagram (if available) can be useful in identifying possible locations. Front-end loaders may have up to eight pistons (four on each side) actuating the lift arm, the bucket, a pivot point (so the loaded bucket can turn) and side support legs. As an example, if you're working on a tractor shovel and the boomleverisoperated,highpressureisshownonthe gauge.... pullthe bucket lever.Ifthe pressuredrops backto normal operating pressure....you have cut your troubleshooting take the rod side hoses off the cylinders. Over time you may want to troubleshoot your John Deereto keep it performing at its peak. Unfortunately, no such fluid exists for hydraulic machine efficiency and longevity. Whether a stainless steel bracket mount or a plastic insert clamp, go around and tighten all the fasteners. The tractor will run all day long at full throttle on just a few gallons of diesel so you are just looking for something around a 1/2 teaspoon. This temperature-viscosity shows that an ideal hydraulic fluid would exhibit no change in viscosity regardless of temperature. A stainless steel bracket mount or a defective female coupler of position, actual operating typically! 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